Full-Back, Wing-Back, Semi-Side Back, Center-Back, Stopper, Sweeper and Advanced Sweeper.
49. Carles Puyol
2010 World Defender of The Year
"The
Shark" Carles Puyol was one of the best defenders in the World during
second half 2000s and is one the most decorated defenders ever as being the
main pillar of both Barcelona and Spain in its glory years. He is regarded as
one the greatest captains of all-time, known for his leadership and work ethic.
Mainly a central defender, he was a versatile player who could also feature on
either flank mostly as right-back in the first part of his career. He was
known for his commanding presence in the air despite his modest stature, as
well as his ability to read the game, man-marking skill and ability to organize
the defense including his intense commitment and ruggedness. He was named in
UEFA Team of the year 6 times, FIFPRO World XI 3 times and ESM team of the month 22 times and team of the year 4 times. He was nominated in Ballon'Dor twice om 2006 and 2010. His best
place in BallonDor is 11th in 2010.
1 Time Italian Series A, 1 Time Coppa Italia
2019 Copa America Best Player
"The
Trantula" Daniel Alves is the best side-back in the world during the 2010s
and is the best right-back in history of La Liga football and UEFA Champion
League. He was known in particular for his pace, stamina, overlapping attacking
runs and technical skills which also enable him to play as a side-midfielder.
He is renowned for his gift in crossing accuracy and distribution with allow
him to link up with midfielders and made him an effective assist provider with
227 assist in overall career and ability to score from long-range set-piece.
Although not specialized in defensive aspect, he possesses great tenacity and
anticipation to intercept passes or chase down and press opponents. Alves
played 14 seasons in La liga and he met his career highlight with Barcelona in
its golden era. However, Alves was not as successful with Brazil as Barcelona.
He wasn't a regular starter in World Cup during his prime. He was named 5 Times
UEFA Team of the year, 31 Times ESM team of the month and 5 Times ESM team of the year including 8 Times FIFPro World XI.
2 Times UFEA Champion League Runner-Up (1997,1998)
Nation : Uruguay
Caps. : 42 Games
Major Club : Penarol
Victor Rodriguez Andrade was the greatest half-backs in the World during the 1st half 1950s, could operate in the both side from his effective two feet according to the metodo system. He was regarded as a successor as a nephew of Jose Leandro Andrade. V.R.Andrade was a complete defensive player with considerable physical and technical asset and help the great balance between defensive and offensive role. He start career at Central Espanyol and moved for Penarol where he met his peak career. He was best known for his highlight at the 1950 world cup final when he was assigned to mark the great Brazilian Zizinho and his performance result is one o fthe keys to help Uruguay win the trophy. Andrade was also successful in the 1954 World Cup and is the only Uruguayan player in his generation to win both World Cup and South American championship which is its first trophy within 10 years.
Caps : 180 Games
World Cup Participation : 2006, 2010, 2014
Club Honours : 5 Times Spanish La Liga
2 Times Copa Del Rey, 3 Times World Club Cup
4 Times UEFA Champion League (2014,2016,2017,2018)
International Honours : 2010 FIFA World Cup
2 Times UEFA Euro Winners (2008, 2012)
Individual Achievement : 5 Times La Liga Best Defender
2005 La Liga Breakthrough Players of the Year
4 Times ESM Team of the Year (2008, 2012, 2015, 2017)
2010 FIFA World Cup All-Star Teams, 2012 UEFA Euro Best XI
2014 FIFA Club World Cup Golden Ball
2017 LFP La Liga Player of the Season
2017 UEFA Champion League Best Defender
"The Tarzan" Sergio Ramos is the most decorated defender ever and the greatest defender of the world during the mid-2010s and is known as the most important defender of Real Madrid in is dominant era that won UEFA Champion League 4 times. Ramos is not known as being world-class in his defensive skill but he is extraordinary in offensive skill, excel in air due to his elevation and heading accuracy and very dangerous in set-pieces. He is an aggressive tackler and is gifted with pace, technical ability as well as great distribution. He is one of fastest footballer in a long run with 30.6 Km per hour. He is tactically versatile allowed him to deploy as full-back at beginning of his career and center-back in his prime career. He incredibly won 2014 FIFA CLub World Cup top scorer, proving him being excellent in scoring task which he made around 90 goals through his career. His is named in FIFPro World XI 8 times, UEFA team of the year 7 times and ESM team of the month 26 times and team of the year 4 times. He achieves 5th place FIFA Footballer of the year in 2017.
2013 UEFA Champion League, 2 Times Runner-Up
2014 FIFA World Cup Champion
3 Times FIFA World Cup All-Stars Team (2006, 2010, 2014)
2019 Premier League Player of the Season
2019 UEFA Defender of the Season
2019 UEFA Nation League Best XI
2019 UEFA Men Player of The Year
2019 Silver Ball FIFA Best Men Player of the Year
"Aquaman" Virgil Van Dijk is the best defender in the World during the late 2010s to early 2020s and is considered as one of the most all-round center-backs of all-time. He is supern in positional sense, physically strong, possesses aerial prowess and great pace and agility for his height, is also described as a smooth ball-playing defender, effective set-piece taker and ability to read the game and know how to judge his timing and wait for the right moment to challenge. Van Dijk played as a pivotal role in defense for Liverpool that reached 3 UEFA Champion League finals. He was named in 3 Times PFA team of the year, 3 Times UEFA team of the year, 4 times UEFA Champion League squad of the season, 18 Times ESM team of the month and 3 Times team of the year and 2 Times FIFPRO World XI. he was nominated in Ballon'Dor twice in 2019 and 2022 and finished the highest place for defender position.
_______________________________________
38. Alan Hansen
37. Hans Peter Briegel
_______________________________________
36. Claudio Gentile
3 Times European Defender of The Year (1956, 1957, 1958)
Billy Wright is one of the great legends in history of British football, is the best defender in the Europe during the 1950s. He signed as professional at 17 years old and then became the first football player in the world to earn 100 caps. Wright was a central defender and a captain of England national team through decade of 1950s. He was the most popular player for English’s football fan during his era with his profession and reliability of football playing. Wright was a master of timing both in terms of beating taller players to headers and winning the ball in strong tackles. He also had a remarkable reading of the game, able to break up attackers with almost telepathic interception and launch quick break upfield. He made 541 appearances to Wolvehampton and regarded as club’s greatest player ever, Specialty, A statue of him was erected beside Wolves' Molineux Stadium in memory of him in 1996, three years after the completion of a stand at the stadium named in honour of him. He is rated by many as the second greatest defender of England only to Bobby Moore. Wright also finished 9th and 6th place Ballon'Dor in 1956 and 1958 respectively. He was named by Mundo Esportivo in 1954 FIFA World Cup All-Stars team.
34. Karlheinz Forster
VFB Stuttgart Greatest Player Ever
1958 Spanish La Liga Footballer of the Year
1961 European Defender of The Year
_______________________________________
30. Fabio Cannavaro
2000 UEFA Euro Team of The Tournament
2 Times Series A Defender of the Year (2005, 2006)
_______________________________________
28. Javier Zanetti
Position : Stopper, Major Club : Juventus, Borussia Dortmund
Jurgen Kohler is
widely considered as the finest European stoppers or man’s markers ever. He was
one of the most completed stopper with his strong, positional play and
precision tacking , Although an aerial ability and speed were skills he was
just in average only but Kohler always manage it with his tactical ability,
known as a pure defender not available in technical option. Kohler was totally
rated by kicker in 2.5 world-class seasons and 8.5 international-class seasons,
noted for his world-class in a half season for 5 years.In the 1991 - 1992
season, Italian Media's rating to him is overlapped to world-class even kicker
rates in international-class only. He was strong as if being a steel wall could
mark many superstars out of their games. Kohler used to give an interview that
there was no strikers who could make him trouble through his career. According
to German Footballer of the year voting, He was German defender of the year in
only twice times and was named in Bundesliga team of the season six times and was
the most weekly appearances of a Bundesliga team of the season once in 1988.
Kohler was nominated in Ballon'Dor once in 1997 and finished 11th place. He
was chosen by 3 medias from total 12 in 1990 FIFA World Cup best XI.
_______________________________________
24. Jose Nasazzi
2 Times Copa America Best Player (1923,1935)
Andreas Brehme is
considered to be one of the greatest free-kick takers and crossers of all time
as one of a few players in the world who could play with both feet equally
well, making him valuable as an outfield player. He was best remembered as a
winning-scorer with taking penalty in World Cup 1990 final round. Brehme was
great in stamina, positional play, precision crossing and teamwork ability. In
Bundesliga Game, He was rated in international-class 5 seasons as left
wing-back plus a season as central defensive midfielder. His individual
performance in Italian Series A coud be rated in 2 World-Class seasons. Brehme
totally scored 65 goals in his whole professional career. According to German
Footballer of the year voting, He finish 2nd place in 1990 and was German
defender of the year only once time. He was also nominated in 1989 Ballon'Dor,
finished 14th.
1998 FIFA World Team Of Century
____________________________________
21. Karl-Heinz Schnellinger
1962 Bronze Ball European Footballer of The Year
3 Times European Defender of The Year (1962, 1963, 1964)
Karl-Heinz Schnellinger was the best defender in the World in the first half 1960s. He was not only rated in 3.5 world-class seasons in Bundesliga and all World Cup tournaments he played from kicker ranking but also a consistency world-class defender in Italian series A in several years. Schnellinger mainly played as left-back in 4-4-2 system but he sometimes was used as sweeper for Germany which he was still rated in world-class in world cup 1970. He was noted for his superlatively positional play, tackling ability, physical power pace and his winning mentality. Moreover, Schnellinger also did offensively duty well especially his long passing. His best year was 1962 which was the only year he won 2 major individual awards. According to German Footballer of the year voting, He was German defender of the year only twice times. Schnellinger was voted in 5th, 11th and 12th Ballon'Dor between 1963 and 1965, respectively.
19. Ronald Koeman
2 Times European Defender of The Year (1988, 1992)
1981 Bronze Ball South American Footballer Of The Year
1992 Brazilian League Footballer of The Year
2 Times South American Defender of The Year (1981,1982)
17. Hector Chumpitaz
16. Matthias Sammer
_______________________________________
15. Alessandro Nesta
2 Times Brazil National Champions
12. Jose Leandro Andrade
1924 Olympics Games Best Player
11. Nilton Santos
_______________________________________
1981 Guerin Italian Series A Footballer Of The Year
2 Times European Defender of The Year (1978, 1979)
_______________________________________
9. Elias Figueroa
3 Times Uruguayan League Best Player
1981 Chile Sportsman Of The Year
2 Times Brazilian League Footballer Of The Year (1972, 1976)
5 Time South American Defender of the Year (1973 - 1977)
8. Berti Vogts
____________________________________
6. Daniel Passarella
3 Times South American Defender of The Year (1978,1979,1980)
1968 UEFA Euro Best Defender
2 Times European Defender of The Year (1965, 1968)
1966 FIFA World Cup Best Defender, European Defender of The Year
1998 FIFA World Team of Century
2 Times European Defender of The Year (1989, 1993)
1994 FIFA World Cup Best Defender
4 Times European Defender of The Year (1994, 1995, 2003, 2005)
1976 European Championship Runner-Up
1999 Silver Ball IFFHS European Player of The Century
Caps : 71 Games
Paul Janes is the
best defender in the world in the second half 1930s and is considered as a
player who helped to shape the beginning phase of German football was a member
and leader of the famous legend "Breslau Eleven" which is refer to
Germany national team in the 1930s .Paul Janes established a record for most
German caps which wasn’t broken until 1970. Janes started out as a right half
back, but during the 1934 World Cup he debuted as right back and stayed at that
position for the rest of his career. One of Janes’ best assets was his powerful
yet accurate shooting ability, which gave him the nickname "World Champion
of Precision". His trademark was hard shots from all possible angles. He
rarely was caught off-guard on the pitch, as he had the ability to anticipate
what the opponent was planning and he interpreted defensive play always as the
first step in building up the next attack. His career was interrupted by World
War I but still return to play firs-level matches in the post-war era and
retired at 38 years old. The DFB list him in the top 20 best German footballers
of all time. Paul-Janes Stadium, homeground of Dusseldorf in the past was named
after him
Argentina : 2
Spain : 2
2010s : 3.5
Class : Crown
None
|
||
Class : King
|
||
Gold
None
|
Silver
Franz Beckenbauer
|
Bronze
Paolo Maldini, Franco Baresi
|
Class : Queen
|
||
Gold
Bobby Moore, Daniel Passsarella,
Giacinto Facchetti,
Gaetano Scirea, Nilton Santos, Elias
Figueroa, Ruud Krol
|
Silver
Giuseppe Bergomi
Carlos Alberto, Djalma Santos, Alessandro Nesta, Berti Vogts, Matthias Sammer, Jose Leandro Andrade
Fabio Cannavaro, Lilian Thuram Roberto
Carlos, Jose Nasazzi, Jurgen Kohler, Billy Wright
Andreas Brehme, Antonio Cabrini
Domingos Da Guia,
Leovegildo Junior, Karlheinz Schnellinger Hector Chumpitaz, Javier Zanetti |
Bronze
Albert Shesternev, Claudio Gentile
Carles Puyol, Marcel Desailly
Hans Peter Briegel,
Alessandro Costacurta Daniel Alves, Ciro Ferrara
Phillipe Lahm, Manuel Amoros Laurent Blanc, Fernando Hierro,
Victor Rodriguez Andrade
Karlheinz Forster, Jose Santamaria, Marcos Cafu |
Roberto Perfumo : Argentina/Late 60s to Early 70s
Fritz Tarp : Denmark/20s
Pietro Vierchowod : Italy/80s to Early 90s
Jose Antonio Camacho : Spain/80s
Luis Pereira : Brazil/1970s
3. Jose Leandro Andrade
6. Paolo Maldini
7. Gaetano Scirea
9. Lilian Thuram
10. Ronald Koeman
Good evening! I am a little confused by equalizing role-libero and sweeper. As for me and my knowledge of football, it's a different role. Libero- word itself suggests, libero- free. These are the players who are usually played in front of two center-back. They had better ball control than conventional center back. They had the initiative forward. Classic examples are: Beckenbauer, Morten Olsen, Sammer ... Sweeper- word itself says it all. Usually behind the two center back. It has a sense of organization and accountability, and usually more defensive characteristics. Franco Baresi is known to play as well as Popluhár and Vasovic. The last thing I remember, it was Igor Stimac in the Croatian jersey at the World Cup in France. And libero and sweeper possess distinct leadership traits. A distinction is made by me and posit stopper. The most classic examples are by me Bergomi Kohler and Gentile. Today's dominant classic center back. Kind regards!
ReplyDeleteI think it should have been cleared about the global name of sweeping role and advanced defender role but honesty even nowadays it is still not clear and Libero is actually just a sweeper in Italian language by no difference of extent. I understand your point and at least I should differentiate it, I’d revise position name as “advanced sweeper” for Beckenbauer, Sammer, Scirea, Passarella, Olsen, Vasovic, etc
DeleteMorten Olsen began his career on the right wing. He continued as a defensive midfielder, and is remembered solely as a libero. The position of center-back in Anderlecht have played with him Peruzovic, Broos and Grun, and the Danish national team, Ivan Nielsen and Busk. They all stood behind him like a fuse while he was free after their operation. He was a libero. He was not a center back or defensive midfielder. Otherwise, the entire idea of the level of information is great. Kind regards!
ReplyDeleteOh, I see. I copied his profile from another player and change details but forgot to change position in all-time Denmark squad. Surely Olsen’s peak was performed as advanced sweeper but he also played as defensive midfielder so long.
DeleteYes, he played until his 31 years. Tomislav Ivic was moved in 1980 to the position of libero. And there was only entered into legend. In this position he played is why it is respected
ReplyDeleteCan you make a top 10 list just by defending skill? Not as overall player quality but just defending.
ReplyDeleteVery good idea ! but for this post, it includes only performance aspect so I’ve provided the list of them. Please see in the post. For the best pure defending skill, It is very similar to performance list, just move E.Figueroa to be ahead of Bobby Moore.
DeleteAnd what about Sammer?
DeleteOh, sorry, i didn't see the your new list i thought you were referring to best peak list.
Delete"The Greatest Pure Defending Performers Ever
ReplyDelete1. Baresi 2. Maldini 3. Moore 4. Figueroa 5. Scirea 6. Vogts
7. Nesta 8. Santamaria 9. Bergomi 10. Facchetti"
I would take out Moore, Figueroa, Vogts, Santamaria, Scirea, Facchetti and add:
Kohler
Thuram
Tresor
Desailly
Gentile
Forster
In my opinion Nesta and Baresi are the top two pure defenders. Intelligence, technique and effectiveness. Gentile and Bergomi the two greatest Italian markers.
Kohler and Forster, the two best German pure stoppers I have seen need to be included.
Desailly, Thuram and Tresor, physically dominant but very intelligent.
My All-Time Top 10 Complete Defenders
Baresi=Scirea>Beckenbauer
Nesta>Maldini
Moore>Figueroa
Passarella>Facchetti
Krol
You say Krol obtained the highest point average seasonal rating by media among defenders in history. Can you post a link with this source?
ReplyDeleteIt is the rating in dbscalcio.com. Krol got around 7.00 average point in that season. Anyway, the standard of given points is different between eras.
DeleteVasovic has to be in front of Amoros and Vierchowod
ReplyDeleteDear, Readers
ReplyDeleteIt will be a good news for AC Milan's fan. After I calculate performance of Costacurta in the system, I found he would beat Jacinto Quincoces who was extremely limited in opportunity in both domestic and international career. The professional Spanish La Liga was created when he was already 24 years old but he first participated at his 25 years old and unfortunately Spanish Civil War prevent him from extending his career after playing in La Liga only 6 seasons. Therefore, his domestic career is below average in term of longevity. Internationally, he won only 25 caps as there were a few available games at that time.
Note that all performances of Costacurta calculated into the system all are from 1990s. For the 2000s, he is considered below international-class.
Carlos Alberto has to be Queen Silver class and you have omitted the class of Vierchowod and Zebec.
ReplyDeleteLahm and john terry should be in this list. also kaltz.
ReplyDeleteWhat about Bixente Lizarazu?
ReplyDeleteBixente Lizarazu was once named in my top 50 DF when I first created the list. He was rated by kicker only 6 international-class seasons. He participated only 60 % of total Bundesliga matches during 7 seasons due to injury and he seems to be below average on body condition for defender position which is required a high consistent physical condition. I think he got to his prime a bit too late at the latter of 20 years old. He was also never voted high place in Ballon’Dor based on defender standard.
DeleteHi Dearman, I am very interested in your take on Maldini vs Baresi.
ReplyDeleteI am pretty sure Dani Alves should be here. Cafu is 29. and 15. in def. lateral while Alves is 34. They play similar style and while Cafu is better the difference certainly is not that large.
ReplyDeleteI see Cafu is stronger and made a mistake much less than Daniel Alves. Importantly, Cafu is far better in performance for Brazil national team.
DeleteThe difference is done in Brazil National team even if it's really hard to not see D.Alves higher.
DeleteHowever he was also good with Juventus... did a good start with QSG.
Does it change something ?
P. G.
He is the best right back in the World in at least 5 years but there is really no close candidate in this era. His best place in ballon dor is only 19th. I think it is clear hevis not good enough.
DeleteI would suggest Sergio Ramos
ReplyDeleteFrom his first season as a starter he impresses being named La Liga breaktrough player of the year
In his first Season at Real Madrid he already becomes an undisputed starter.
Next year he becomes World Class , and even amongst the top players
http://www.xtratime.org/forum/156-world-football/226571-xtratime-world-player-year-2007-countdown-3.html
Here he was voted 15th best player of the year.
Next Year he became the greatest defender in the world , fact highlighted at the Ballon d'Or aswell. And he was included in all the Best XI of the year(ESM/FIFA/UEFA)
Next Season Real founded difficult time and no recognition is available but he was still Real's best defender.
In 2010 he was the 6th best player in La Liga according to average ratings and also won the World Cup being named MVP according to player grades.
In 2011 , he is named in FIFA Team of the Year
In 2012 he is the best defender on the planet being named La Liga Best Defender, UEFA Team of the Year , ESM Team of the Year and won the EURO being named MVP according to castrol ratings. Also highest defender at the Ballon d'Or.
In 2013 he's named La Liga Best Defender and included in UEFA Team of the Year and FIFA Team of the Year.
In 2014 he's named La Liga Best Defender and included in UEFA Team of the Year and FIFA Team of the Year having a remarkable year with his heroics for Real , CWC Mvp , being even tiped for the Ballon d'Or by some personalities.
In 2015 , he was for the 4th time consecutively named La Liga Best Defender fo the Year and was included in all possible all star teams of the year(ESM/UEFA/FIFA)
In 2016 thing will be no different. He is already named in La Liga and UCL team of the season and UCL Final Motm.
He has won and incredible amount of trophies and qualities and was always rewarded in all competitions with individual recognition , whether it was as usually for awards with opinion of experts , or even based on objective statistics. He has 136 caps at such a young age and is surely qualified for your list.
Another defender who has been equally impressive with Ramos in this era has been Lahm , who surely surpassed Schulz in German history.
I advise you include both Ramos and Lahm in the ranking.
It is unnecessary to consider the data of awards or status of rating in Sergio Ramos case when we have seen him enough and I’m very clear his defensive ability is not good enough. Nowadays he played against much easier attackers also. I suggest you to lay down your biased view on Real Madrid players. Lahm is rated by kicker in national level in too many times.
DeleteHe plays many times per year against Messi,Suarez,Neymar,Iniesta etc. That is far from easy. In fact it is probably the most effective atacking trio in history.
DeleteAnd you have defenders in your ranking who weren't world class at defending , as opossed to Ramos.
He was rated as the 6th best player in La Liga in 2010 mostly on defensive contribution , having 90 succesful tackles and 119 interceptions in that season and also 3.7 tackle per game in the UCL.
Next season he made 81 succesful tackles in La Liga and was dribbled past only 7 times in the ENTIRE league season. That is outstanding.
And I'd give more weight to wide media rating than to kicker. Lahm has been constantly ranked the best/one of the best defenders in the world for so many seasons just like Ramos , and even amongst the top players of the world.
I don’t mention to those famous superstar specifically since it is just happen in Spanish Derby Match. I was talking about overall attackers in nowadays. The modern era has very few world-class defenders in comparison to the previous eras so his more prolific awards or greater statistics doesn’t mean he is better than a ton of the world-class defenders that congregated in the past.
DeleteAnd you base that on something else than your wishes?
DeleteI reffered to that Spanish derby match because it is what people usualy follow of him. Ramos has had to face the likes of Ronaldinho , Eto'o , David Villa , Diego Forlán , Diego Milito , Deco , Iniesta , Sergio Agüero , Thierry Henry , Zlatan Ibrahimović , Radamel Falcao , Alexis Sánchez , Diego Costa , Antoine Griezmann , Cesc Fàbregas , Luis Suárez , Neymar , Messi etc. in La Liga. What fierce atacking players did Schulz , Andrade , Janes , Shesternev , Marzolini , Vasovic etc face that makes Ramos' look weak? In fact at least ahlf of the list hasn't faced the amount of atacking talent that Ramos faced in his league.
ReplyDeleteHow can Victor Rodriguez Andrade be ahead of Ramos? Neither of us have seen Andrade play so I can't make an accurate comparasion in abilities but the only(or at least most famosu) source that caompares players abilities troughout eras is pes stats wich as inaccurate as they are , they are very generous on legend stats and have been criticised for overrating them often.
Andrade vs Ramos in pes stats:
Atack: 70-75
DEFENCE:80-84
Balance:83-85
Stamina:91-87(I doubt it but I give them the benefit of doubt)
Top speed:84-84(FIFA's official records confirmed that Ramos has been clocked at a sprinting speed of 30.6 kilometers per hour so I doubt this one aswell)
Acceleration:82-81
Response:85-86
Aggility:86-77
Dribbling accuracy:82-83
Dribble speed:84-81
Short pass acc:84-81
Short pass speed:78-82
Long pass acc:82-85
Long pass speed:80-84
Shoot acc:74-69
shoot power:82-83
shoot technique:75-75
Free kick:72-74
curl:74-83
heading:80-92
jump:85-90
technique:84-83
aggresion:72-76
mentality:87-86(Ramos is nicknamed the Lion but maybem I misunderstand this stats and has to do with his composure)
team work:90-70
In clonclusion Ramos is clearly the superior player. If you have any more realiable stat in your head maybe it could change but I'd agree no doubt Ramos is better.
Consistency is out of the question with most defenders. Ramos has started as a super early bloomer and has been amongst the best year by year also reaching an insane amount of caps.
Trophy cabinet is abnormal , with also a ton of individual awards.
He has proven himself in the best league in the wrold , in the best club competition and at NT level at the highest level in both EURO and WC.
And has been rated at the highest in both awards , statistics and praise by all time greates(Maldini said he is his heir , Ancelotti compared him to Maldini , Cannavaro tipped him for Ballon d'Or etc.)
How can Ramos not be far ahead of Andrade in the ranking?
V.R Andrade has its own problem to acquire evidence is different story to consider S.Ramos who has long been seen his footage. You list only attacker names of the current era but omit to name all of great attackers in the previous era. I don’t need to waste time to type every name but each nations had a more competitiveness of candidates to be a starter. In nowadays, who could beat Rooney in his decline period, who is the best forwards in these years and they’re even not closed to Van Nistelrooy, Van Basten. Look at Italy is even worse. There is no top-class Forwards for a long time. In 90s, there was a ton of top-class forwards (Baggio, Zola, Signori, Mancini, etc). Germany is the post-era of Klose is a main reason why Germany failed in the recent Euro. There is no great target striker until Thomas Muller essentially took this role.
DeleteRamos appeared twice times in FIFA Ballon’Dor and finished 19th and 23th is not impressive for a player who won many international trophies and as I said this era is considered to be weaker in quality of top level group.
DeleteRamos has been nominated at the Ballon d'Or 3 times (you ommited 2008?) , 2 of wich he was the highest rated defender of the year. And in 2014 he was the 2nd because of a brillant performance from Lahm.
DeleteSo please break it down for better understanding , why is Andrade ahead of Ramos? I understand it's difficult to present his career as explicit as Ramos' , but you have to have your reasoning. I just showed you in the last comments how good Ramos have been , so please clarify why you rank Andrade above him.
It has not been a secret that players in the pre-1960s have a very few evidence of footage to watch but their value in their own era should be saved. Andrade in the 1954 World Cup was seen to be one of the best Uruguayan players and is deserved top 10 best players of tournament. Andrade anyway was a more midfielder if applied to nowadays tactic so his offensive quality is way greater than general full-back. He was very all-round players, strong and technical approach.
DeleteBut this issue is not needed to link with Ramos. Even there is none of Andrade, Ramos is still not qualified and I don’t want to waste too much time with you biased view on Real Madrid players Pele10brazil. I have a ton of works to done.
I have not spoken anything biased in these comments really... Only facts mate. And I'll let you know that Ramos has also been succesfully deployed as a midfielder and he was also ranked MVP of both EURO and World Cup according to objective average ratings. Alltough it doesn't refelcts the truth , that bassically makes Andrade's biggest achievement of being one of the best players at World Cup irellevant. I was just trying to point out that there is no relevance in Andrade's ranking ahead of Ramos and was not trying to disrupt your work. I also make my own series and wanted to be more educated on the matter. But as a side note , Andrade isn't the only defender on the list that I highlighted as clearly inferior to Ramos. When you have time I can break down the same way as I have proved with Andrade with many other defenders.
DeleteP.S. Many of my comments here have modified your works and helped you with your series so I wouldn't call my comments waste of time. Cheers!
There is no fact on the player rating. It is biased because you cite only awards and raw rating without analysis of data. Also, you mention and prepare stats for only Real Madrid players.
DeleteBy fact I meant that the awards and statistics. Based on them and , forming an overall performance augumented by overall ability and opinions of contemporary experts and greats , I formed an opinion around Ramos status in history. And I was curious on your motivation on some of the recipients on the list being ahead of him(the example I took being Andrade).
DeleteRamos once again magnificent being named MotM in the UEFA Super Cup. He is dominating his era!
DeleteI suggest a bit revision on Roberto Carlos' role. He was clearly regarded ahead of his contemporaries Thuram and Nesta.
ReplyDeleteIt is known that Carlos was clearly inferior in defensive abilities but afaik this is not a ranking of pure defenders , otherwise he would be lower than 15.
Given that for example , Nesta and R.Carlos were both contemporary defenders , here is how they were both rated:
Nesta: 5th-2000 , 14/15th-2001 , 16th-2003 , nom-2004
R.Carlos: 5th-1997 , 13th-1998 , 26/31th-1999 , 16th-2000, 18/21th-2001 , 2nd-2002 , 8th-2003 , nom-2005(Ballon d'Or)
Also at the FIFA WPOTY it's still crushing:
Nesta: 8th-2000
R.Carlos: 2nd-1997 , 4th-2002 , 5th-2003
And World Soccer Player of the Year:
Nesta: 10th-2000
R.Carlos: 4th-1997 , 3rd-2002 , 9th-2003
And also rated by the wide poll of expert all across Europe , in the ESM Team of the Year , Roberto Carlos has been included an ALL TIME RECORD 7 times , while Nesta has ZERO inclusions.
With Thuram , the comparasion would ne the same , only not so far better. The satus of them is clear , R.Carlos is even rated by many as one of the greatest in modern era , while the 2 are only amongst defenders.
Maldini or Baresi should be 1st
ReplyDeleteI don't see Lahm in this list. I think he definitely deserves a mention in this list.
ReplyDeleteWhen this season will have been completed, we will see if his rating will be good enough to be ranked in top 50.
DeleteCan you also compile a list for all the full-backs? Right now, you clubbed all kinds of defenders together. How about making a separate list for each type of player? Great work apart from that! I hope you are doing well.
DeleteActually there is another categorization list, please find in http://xtraimmortal.blogspot.com/2014/02/The9x100.html
DeleteThanks mate!
DeleteMy friend, I believe that Elias Figueroa should be listed as National Team A, because according to FIFA.COM article of Figueroa, He was considered the best defender of 1974 World Cup and member of star team of this tournament. Chile did not pass the group stage, but Elías Figueroa who wore the Chilean shirt, reached the highest position as defender by over others like Beckenbauer.
ReplyDeleteIt is also necessary to add in the recognitions that Figueroa was considered better player of the Uruguayan league, that was are in all his splendor, when Figueroa barely had 19 years in 1968, 1969 and 1970.
ReplyDeleteRecapitulating Figueroa was
*The best defender and part of star team 1974 WC.
*Best player of Uruguayan league in 1968-1969-1971.
Thanks, I'll add these awards status.
DeleteAfter another great season with very significant achievements, is Ramos finally going to be included in the list?
ReplyDeleteNo revision on him like you did too Lahm?
DeleteHe has been ranked up in the 9 x 100 positional ranking list but still far to be listed here. His pure defensive skill is not competitive enough.
DeleteHe has been included in the ESM Team of the Year once again this season and scored the most goals in his career. Yet another world class season from Ramos and I wonder how long till you will rank him because he has by far a better career than many on the list(not even talking about trophies but individual performance at the highest level in all competitions).
DeleteOK, That is impressive but note there are not many world-class defenders in the recent era so some related year he was named in FIFPro, UEFA,ESM team of the year could not guarantee his world-class performance standardized with other era. Why I can say that, just check FIFA Ballon Dor ranking since 2012, Only 2016 that the best defender (Pepe) could be voted in top 15 and most of them even below top 20. Ramos was best defender in the World based on FIFA Ballon'dor place in 2012 and 2014 but he was placed at 18th and 23th that is very low. However, he has been dramatically ranked up in central defender list from 68th to 56th as I reviewed his rating again.
DeleteI agree there aren't as many great defenders as years ago but he also was the highest rated defender at the 2008 Ballon d'Or. And FIFA separeted the awards again in 2016 so it's worthy to mention that he was the highest rated defender at the 2016 FIFA World Player of the Year.
DeleteAll in all, I think there are very few defenders in history with so many individual accolades.
In my opinion Carles Puyol should be included in this list. He was a pure class defender with leadership ability. Was he even close to reach this top 50 ?
ReplyDeletePlease in the 9x100 positional ranking list. He is placed around 50th best central defender ever but only 30 central defenders are listed here.
DeleteAnyway 50th best central defender is in my opinion not enough. I may be wrong but what makes him that low ? I am interested.
DeleteP. G.
He dominates defender position in his era but his pure ability isn't that great. He have an easier jobs than many other defenders as his team's ball possession is always high percentage.
DeleteAlways a pleasure to argue :)
DeleteOn the one hand it seems easier to be a defender when your team has possession because you have "less to do", on the other hand when you have to defend in such teams, it's often high on the pitch, with a lot of space to cover and you are faced to "new generation" fast defender such as robben and nobody covers you etc ...
"Less to do" but often harder tasks and I am not sure highly rated "slow" defender would have performed successfully in such situations.
Moreover, with all the respect I have for him, S.Busquets is not the best defensive midfielder to cover a defense.
We can see what gives Spain Defense without Puyol... or Barça's defense when Puyol got older
Then I would add in tactics like the one used by Juventus in 2017 and even if there is "more work", it doesn't mean the work is so complicated for a skilled defender because tactic is done to ease defense and close gaps.
All this to say, I understand your arguments, but I find it strict applied to Puyol
P. G.
I see. Defender in dominated team face a heavier jobs from counter-attack. Puyol did some great performances in this task help Barca surviving from goal conceding several times but he also made many mistakes as I remember well. I'm not impressed with his positional sense.
DeleteLast thing and I am done. Let's take the example of W.Samuel 92 in the 9x100 list. He is the kind of defender with high defending abilities. He is only 92, I presume, because he fails at real madrid.
DeleteBut this failure also shows for a "skilled defender" it's not always easy to be succesful in a team that has possession or with an attacking mentality.
All this to show somebody like Terry for example may have been in trouble in such teams but I can not prove it. It's for me the same kind of arguments that to say "it's easier" when your team has possession.
Anyway, I know I won't manage to convince you to put Puyol higher on the list if I understood your philosophy (the right one I think as it prevents from only focusing on the palmares) but here is my personal feeling about Puyol.
P. G.
W.Samuel got many injuries and also I saw him too rough defender unnecessarily. He always made a fouls to opponent instead of fairly tackle.
DeleteDomingos Da Guia ahead of Fabio Cannavaro? What sorcery is this? Cannavaro is surely far better. One is one of Brazil's best defenders and the other is widley regarded as one of the greatest defenders of all time.
ReplyDeleteWell, I don't think Cannavaro is one of the best defenders ever. He was not great enough in air (Refer to the scene he was beaten by Salas heading goal in the 1998 World Cup and his mistake in the 2000 Euro draw goal). He is also lack of basic technique for defender.
DeleteDomingos Da Guia is highly creditable for his dribbling and technical skill with considerable defensive ability (even it is surely inferior to Cannavaro). Anyway, I'll keep this issue for further study since there are no evidence rating for Domingos Da Guia.
Remember how Cannavaro got owned by Carew in champions league.
DeleteNot good in air??? He is one of the legendary defenders when it comes to aerial ability.
ReplyDeleteFrom his wikipedia:
"he was highly regarded for his aerial ability, courtesy of his elevation, physical strength, athleticism, timing, and heading accuracy, which enabled him to outjump larger players, and made him particularly adept at defending crosses, or at scoring with his head from set-pieces."
Also look at Pes Stats, he has jump 96. And of course anybody who saw him play remembers how he bossed the penalty area where no balls could be coordinated because of his imperial defense. In conclusion Fabio should be ranked much higher than your rating.
Pes stats is not always reliable as there are just a few random clips to assess. Wikipedia is mostly optimistic. I know Cannavaro possesses a relative high jump but he had a problem to manage with the aerial ball. Short player need to spend more time to reach the ball for a high jump than taller player. Not like what Baresi did, he was not great in aerial battle and he was intelligent enough to prevent the situation by taking advantage of position and his opponent struggled to reach the long passed ball by then.
ReplyDeleteYou say about Thuram "high speed" but why do rapidity is only C for him ?
ReplyDeleteI think it is a mistake. However, I don't think his remarkable ability is speed even it should have been higher than C. Revised.
DeleteDon't remember Desailly was that slow : D+ is a bit low no ?
ReplyDeleteHonesty I never think my memory is accurate so I need a time to improve the skill rating.
DeleteSergio Ramos named amongst the 10 best players in Europe this season at the UEFA Men's Player of the Year Award. Another outstanding year for the spanish defender. After all the waiting he surely has to be ranked now.
ReplyDeleteTop100 footballers of all time.Berti Vogts is 90.
ReplyDeleteDjalma Santos is 82.
but berti vogts is better than djalma santos in this list.?
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-TCncrI-_JVI/WccoMDpgJCI/AAAAAAAAOT0/VdvFxHQBG4IQC0LrNCT5bDTvnGOX6zOJgCLcBGAs/s1600/WAGF%2BII.png
I'm surprised that you know what I have just updated. Please just wait. I will update in many lists as Djalma is rated down. He will be also removed from top 100 best player ever.
DeleteStill no Ramos?
ReplyDeleteHe has been ranked 5th best World player of the Year now at the 2017 The Best FIFA Men's Player.
Surely he needs to be ranked since season after season he is outstanding.
"Ramos has been praised for his decisive performances in important games, most notably for Real Madrid, due to his tendency to score clutch goals for his team, and is considered by several pundits to be the best big-game player in the world."-Wikipedia
DeleteIn my opinion Ramos defensive ability is not so impressive and luckily most of his mistakes are compensated by his team and sometimes himself.
DeleteAs the defensive skills are important in this top the only way Ramos could be included may be to perform a world class successful world cup. Naratorn will decide.
However if I understood Naratorn's point of view, expecially when I see Puyol's rating, in team such as spain or barcelona with a high percentage of possession, you are put at a disadvantage because your job consists more in ball-playing than defending. Even if it may sometimes be really to stop counter-attack.
Ramos has been ranked 6th at the Ballon d'Or this year.
ReplyDeleteIf D.Santos is the greatest righ back of all time why there is Thuram and vogts ahead of him ?
ReplyDeleteThere has been a movement in ranking. As I have watched many matches of Djalma, he is not deserved this status anymore.
DeleteFootage of old players will always be disapointing.
DeleteFrom what I remember L.Thuram was a versatile defender, with average offensive skills able to play centre-back, right-back, or semi-right-back. This versatily combined to his great defensive skills may compensate the average offensive skill and makes him a great defender. Thus it may justifiy the ranking in this list.
ReplyDeleteHowever does it mean he is the best right back ever as suggest the 9x100 list ?
Better than D.Santos, C.Alberto, Cafu, Zanetti, Lahm... ?
I also understand defensive skills are more important than offensive skills in your ranking.
Note I understand a player like D.Alves needs to be on top during a big tournament like world cup.
Only equal candidate to him is Berti Vogts who is also great in both defense and offense. I have watched all of them and record skill rating into the calculation system. The result saw Vogts and Thuram is mutually best ever. Note that Thuram peak in 98 world cup is likely to be the best right back performance ever.
DeleteI remember Thuram having troubles marking Munitis in Euro 2000 for example ...
DeleteI remember that scene. Munitiz accelerated inside and Thuram clearly lost his way to another side. Anyway, every defender has a few mistakes or undesirable scenes such as Maldini against Porborski in the 1996 Euro.
DeleteDo you have Top100 footballers of all time ?
ReplyDeleteBeckenbauer, as a midfielder, was box to box, defensive or central holding ?
ReplyDeleteHe could be categorized in both role of box-to-box and defensive holding but box-to-box is more fit when he often went forward as if attacking midfielder.
DeleteWhich left back in this list would suit the best a possession-based game like Guardiola's tiki taka in barcelona ?
ReplyDeleteEspecially if I am convinced Maldini was awesome at defending. What about the offensive part. Would he be ok for Guardiola's Barcelona ?
DeleteMaldini is a great team work player. Tiki Taka is not required a perfect left-back as Abidal was even a part of them with limited offensive ability.
DeleteTrue Abidal was probably the only player with limited offensive ability. I am trying to figure out what would be the greatest 433 false 9 playing tiki taka style of all time. For sure we can accept one player with limited offensive ability but several may break the possession-based game.
DeleteNaratorn, do you have an idea of what would be this team and why ? I want to do a balanced team with the style of barcelona 2008 - 2012 and we have a debate with friends :).
DeleteRequirements are :
- Goal keeper must be a sweeper-keeper
- Centre-backs must be ball-playing centre-backs
- Side backs must be offensive side-backs, with excellent offensive abilities, and pacy to be able to come-back on counter-attack. Average defensive skills may be ok.
- A Defensive-holding midfielder, a central-holding midfielder and a offensive-midfielder. They must be able to sustain a tiki-taka style game, it means they first touch should allow them to not loose anytime to do the next pass.
- Side-Wing Forward must sustain tiki-taka, have average defensive work-rate. Pacy enough to not be caught when they got a through-ball and a decent finishing
- False 9 : natural false 9 is messi but maybe you have better idea.
For you, who was the more skilled player for play only in the wingback position (attack minded)? Nilton Santos, Brehme, Facchetti, Roberto Carlos or Krol?
ReplyDeleteSorry for late reply. As I have watched all of them in many full-matches, I am sure to select Facchetti.
DeleteFacchetti more skillfull than marcelo ?
DeleteSure, skill includes defensive ability also.
DeleteI think the primary question of Anonymous was more related to offensive abilities that's why I suggested Marcelo but I may be wrong.
DeleteSo same question if we consider mainly offensive abilities : L.Junior, Marcelo ...
DeleteSo who is the most offensively skillfull side back of all time ?
DeleteI have not calculated specifically but I'm quite sure Nilton Santos is the best.
DeleteI have seen a few videos and matches and what I could see is he had a good technique and passing but his dribbling ability is clearly under marcelo's one.
DeleteBut maybe you have some materials showing his dribbling is better. I would be interested in.
DeleteI think that Roberto Carlos was the most skilled offensive wing back (focused only in attack). I remember your list of the best skilled players by position and you put Roberto Carlos as the number one. Am I right?
DeleteThat list has been obsoleted. Now I have been making a progressive table. Nilton Santos is much better than R.Carlos in vision and long pass accuracy.
DeleteMmm, maybe in vision, but Roberto Carlos had a great long pass accuracy too. Anyway, don't you think that Nilton was a left back more than a wing back? He was equally offensive as Facchetti and you put the italian like a left back, not a wing back. The wingback position is a modern position. In 1958, Brazil used a 4-2-4 formation with an offensive sideback like Nilton, but he wasnt a wingback. A formation with wingbacks is, for example, the one used by Scolari with Brazil in 2002, with Roberto Carlos and Cafu as a real wingbacks.
DeleteWell, the wing-back will be defined when player's style of play and skill are matched. Nilton is quite balance between defense and offense. His style is not an extreme attacking-mind so I tend to agree he is more full-back.
DeletePreviously, I reply by my approximation but when I make calculation. Roberto Carlos is found to be the most skillful player in attacking skill of side-back. The second one is Paul Breitner.
Can we have the details of the calculation ?
DeleteSure but it is an excel format that has not been complete in overall. I think I should complete it within next month.
DeleteAnd, for you, who is the most skillful wing back on the right side? José Leandro Andrade, Carlos Alberto or Cafu?
DeleteIf you count only offensive skill, Daniel Alves and Nelinho will be one of top players. But for me, as long as they are poor in defence, they should have not been deserved as the best right wing back ever. As long as defensive skill is still their main responsibility.
DeleteOk. But between those three, who is the most skillful? José Andrade, Cafu or Carlos Alberto?
DeleteI think you know how difficult to have watched Jose Leandro Andrade in own eyes but the articles describes he could get pass 4 - 5 players in a world cup match. For me. J.L Leandro Andrade > C.Albeto > Cafu
DeleteAre Alba or Alaba close to the top 100 defensive laterals ?
ReplyDeleteDo we need to wait for the world cup for alba ?
DeleteAgreed Alba may be doing a world class season
DeleteI think Alba will be appeared in top 100 at the end of this season. Before than that, he was too often injury.
DeleteWhat about Alaba ? Maybe in a few years for him.
ReplyDeleteLet see kicker rating on him at the end of season.
DeleteWhat about Boateng as centre-back ? Does he have a chance to reach top 100. Ok he has been injured last seasons but he was awesome at euro 2016 and bayern. Espcially when I see kompany in top 100. I think Boateng may deserve it.
ReplyDeleteI considered him already but he has not collected enough. Anyway he is in my short list to follow his ongoing performance.
DeleteCould Diego Godin enter top 100 centre-back ?
ReplyDeleteI will calculate his performance at the end of season. Previously he was not great enough.
DeleteWhat about Daniel Alves
ReplyDeleteMost probably his last chance to enter this top is to do a world class successful world cup for brazil but I will let Naratorn reply
DeleteHis defensive ability is too weak although he is prolifically the best right-back in the world but no great candidates against him. He is not deserved to be top 50 defender by a large margin.
DeleteEven with a world class world cup and title with brazil ?
DeleteWhat is the difference between a right-back (D.Santos) and a right-full back (Janes, Vogts) ?
ReplyDeleteI intended to right-back as a balanced side-back while full-back is a highly defensive side-back who is weak in offensively. Vogts should have been a right-back as he is also very good offensively.
DeleteOk Vogts is righ-back. Maldini should be left-back too or too weak offensively ? Are you going top update full qualifier when ti's not needer ?
DeleteSergio Ramos ranking?
ReplyDeleteBetween Figueroa and Scirea, who was more skillful? I think that they are similar in technique but Figueroa had an advantage in aerial game.
ReplyDeleteI suggest Scirea who is much better than Figueroa in vision to pass although Figueroa is clearly better in defense.
DeleteIn Uruguay to Figueroa the press called Mr. luxury (Mr. lujo) precisely for his prodigious vision of field and ball driving.
DeleteSource: http://www.emol.com/noticias/deportes/2004/01/02/133774/elias-figueroa-y-las-razones-para-ser-uno-de-los-100-mejores-de-la-historia.html
Sergio Ramos is by far the biggest omission in the ranking. He is by now one of the 20 greatest defenders in football history easily.
ReplyDeleteSergio Ramos has made a lot of mistake, got red cards , was often beaten by top players ... Today we close our eyes and forget it only because he scored headers, sometimes offisde like un UCL Finals. Ramos clearly one of the most overrated defender ever.
DeleteI just calculate S.Ramos skill and he is good enough for top 50 most skillful central defender thanks to his great offensive skill. As I also calculate his performance, it shows he will be placed around 47th here. Let me create his profile.
DeleteYou will have to get rid of grande billy to put a player without any respects for anyone. It will be hard for you.
DeleteI know Costacurta is known to be very reliable in defence but he made mistakes in intercontinental cup 2 years in row. Although Ballon'Dor is not always accurate, Costacurta is never nominated and in he was never rated above 6.2 in dbscalcio database.
DeleteCould beckenbauer or Matthaus plays as defensive holding alone in front of the defense ?
ReplyDeleteSure, Although Beckenbauer is not an uncompromising destroyer, his defensive positional skill allows him to play in this position well. Matthaus ever played as destroyer.
ReplyDeleteyou mean Matthaus never play as destroyer ?
DeleteNo I mean he played in 1986 world cup final, marking Maradona.
DeleteMarcelo is also no doubt an omission for some time now as well even tough in pure defensive skills he is inferior to all the players here. 2 assists last night in the CL final and a key player of the greatest footballing side ever.
ReplyDeleteAbout ramos I don't think 30.6 km.h-1 is so fast for a centre back. Ramos already reached higher pace in la liga just like a lot of defender.
ReplyDeleteBut how it's hard to see Ramos ahead of puyol in your ranking.
I agree it might be overstatement as there is no record for other defenders in previous eras but the stats imply he possesses high stamina.
DeleteWell, I think Puyol will be also named in the list. I really forget to evaluate his skill.
I agree it might be overstatement as there is no record for other defenders in previous eras but the stats imply he possesses high stamina.
DeleteWell, Ramos achieves higher peak in Ballon'Dor place but I really forget to evaluate Puyol skill. I think he might have been better than Vierchowod at least.
Puyol 31 now on the 9x100 list I guess not enough to be seen here :(
DeleteI don't want to say Ramos is slow on the contrary I think he is fast and the figure given doesn't really show it.
DeleteFor your information : nacho Fernandez reached 34.63, Varane often reaches 34 ...
You can also have player like Jagielka reaching 32
D.Santos was downgraded following your skill study during world cup matches ?
ReplyDeleteYes, I specify reason in positional hall of fame. In most matches, he is disappointingly.
DeleteI have also seen a few matches on youtube. On the one hand it might be disappointing but on the other hand does it means he was that much overrated by his pair ?
DeleteI mean I could not see his performances in Domestic seasons ...
Why is José Leandro Andrade in this list now?
ReplyDeleteAs I watch him in the 1924 olympic game final. His position and skill is more matched to right-wing-back in nowadays than defensive midfielder.
DeleteAnd even with the increase it seems we won't see Puyol here if we add new players to the list :(
DeleteNo chance to see Puyol here, even after the review ? :(
ReplyDeleteI've tracked many rating of Puyol in UEFA Champion League, Euro and World Cup match by match, I found he is often rated below 7 point and rarely rate at 8 point. Even in his prime, Ramos is rated better with Spain in most games. The rating is also conformed with my perspective. Puyol are several times mistakes. His status of 2010 world cup all stars team could be overrated. You can check his rating in final and semi-final, he receive only 6 - 7 points.
DeleteS.Ramos is also unreliable in defence but his offensive ability is better than Puyol and Ramos is more successful in UCL. He played well in most competitions. Puyol was not great at 2006 UCL according to the rating and he was injury in 2001 so he was world-class in only 2009.
Instead of ranking player for which I imagine we don't have nearly any materials except reputation. In this list I think about Da Guia, Nasazzi, JL Andrade ...
ReplyDeleteWouldn't it be better to mention them outside of the ranking and put players for which we have enough materials : Puyol, Vierchowod, Schulz, Olsen ...
I say this especially when I see then ew ranking of D.Santos. Luckily we have material for him and it allowed you downgrade him but for the others you may have been disapointed.
DeleteI understand your point. For Djalma Santos, I think he is mainly overrated his 3 times world cup all stars team. At least he is not deserved in 1958 and there were few world-class defender in 1954. However, Players like J.L Andrade ever dribb pass 5 swiss player in 1924 olympic game final. Nasazzi is also seen to be reliable in positional play. For forwards whose no evidence of footage, I think the record of goals can represent their performance significantly.
DeleteMoreover I want to save the greatness in every era. Although they are not proved to be better than players in modern era, I think the circumtance prevention should be considered. They are superb in their era with limitations are eligible to be legend.
DeleteI was thinking to keep them in this page explaining they would have been in the top 50 for sure but we can not be accurate enough.
DeleteEspecially when I see player just like Puyol, Scholes ... close to be in your top 50, it could be a solution to have theam.
Because this site may be a reference in terms of football legend. When some of them are so close to be there, i think it's good to make all we can to have them.
DeleteNo hopes ? :)
DeleteSorry I'm not understand. Could you clarify more ?
DeleteI mean we are close to have in your top 50s player like puyol, scholes, rooney ...
DeleteIf we put in honoroubale mentions players for which we can not be accurate enough I am pretty sure the first players mentionned may enter the top 50s.
And in my opinion it's a good thing for people to see them.
Could we have more than 50 players in The Ability Rating ?
ReplyDeleteRating defensive ability for attackers are difficult task, so I think expanding the list would also increase inaccuracy.
DeleteI asked it also in forward categories, I am really interested in seeing the abiity rating of players such as Bergkamp, Figo ... so if you could so shared it for forwards/offensive midfileder it would be amazing.
DeleteI found the rankings. Thiago Silva ability ranking may be interesting as he seems close to be in top 50.
DeleteI have one question about ability ranking, I am wondering in which period of player career do you evaluate skills. Because getting older player often loose physical ability such as explosive power ...
DeleteMoreover we miss : T.Silva, S.Campbell.
Skill is evaluated at any time of their peak in each skill aspect. For example, Messi' dribbling skill is used at 2010 while his scoring skill is used at 2012.
DeleteCould we have the ability ranking of D.Alves and Marcelo, Please.
ReplyDeleteIn my database, D.Alves is ranked at 65th while Marcelo is at 72th but I did not implement all SBs below top 50. So the ranking for them could be lowered if make a full-implementation.
DeleteIn the 9x100 list I see :
Delete37. Daniel Alves (Brazil)
66. Marcelo Vieira (Brazil)
So at least we should have d.alves :)
Having greater ability doesn't mean to be a greater player and we know it.
Especially I would like to sse how you rate offensive abilities of these players.
DeleteMarcelo named for the 2nd time as the best Left-Back of the World Cup. Mandatory addition!
ReplyDeleteSince attacking players get split 4 ways into attacking midfielders, wingers, forwards and strikers, wouldn't it be fair to separate defenders into centrebacks and fullbacks as well? I know you have a ranking of centrebacks and fullbacks on the 9x100 page but I think it would be nice to have a dedicated page for fullbacks.
ReplyDeleteThanks for putting all this work together, must have taken a lot of time for something that doesn't earn you money.
I am happier to see the similar standard of player levels between positions in 7 main category.
DeleteOk, so you are worried that for example, the 50th ranked fullback won't be of the same class as say, the 50th ranked wide midfielder.
DeleteMost of these rankings here and elsewhere seem to heavily favour attacking players. Do you think that defenders tend to be underrated? Or is it fair enough and defenders are usually genuinely worse players than attacking players?
As I make experiment to rate defender against attackers by value analysis, I don't think I underrate defender. As most defenders are limited in offensive skill, those contributed less than attackers significantly.
DeleteCostacurta, Vasovic, Ferrara are very decorated defenders, but how about comparing with Bruno Pezzey, Roberto Perfumo, Oscar Ruggeri, Willi Schulz?
ReplyDeleteNaratorn Wirunhchatapant14/08/2018, 07:23
DeleteI already rate all of them in scorecard. Pezzey and Schulz is too limited in int.club, Perfumo is disadvantageous in NT career. Ruggeri is often injury.
I think Maldini should be number 1 in the list.
ReplyDeleteWho was better in his prime: Roberto Carlos or Nílton Santos?
ReplyDeleteI'd prefer Roberto Carlos. Nilton is nothing as spectacular as R.Carlos in offensive ability. In defence, I'm not much impressive on Nilton skill as well.
DeleteNo Baresi in peak list?
ReplyDeleteThere is an incongruity between peak list and player evaluaion. Maldini has AA- in peak but he is above Figueroa (AA) and Passarella (AA).
ReplyDeleteRamos Sergio top 20. He winn every cum club and individual
ReplyDeleteSergio Ramos wonn 4 Champions Ligye 5 year .his importat player for the win all tropye. Only 48 plance? I thing top -25 .the best Defender last 6-7 year
ReplyDeleteRamos Sergio won every tropy club and individual .WorldRRamos Sergio won every tropy club and individual .World cup.2x Euro cup. 4 Champions Ligue. Only 48? Xmmmmmamos Sergio won every tropy club and individual .World cup.2x Euro cup. 4 Champions Ligue. Only 48? Xmmmmm cup.2x Euro cup. 4 Champions Ligue. Only 48? Xmmmmm
ReplyDeleteWhat about karl augenthaler ? Have you evaluated him ? Can't he be in the 9x100 list ?
ReplyDeleteDoes copa america 2019 change something for D.Alves or T.Silva ?
ReplyDeleteEspecially D.Alves elected best player of the tournament.
DeleteI could see you moved D.Alves from 37 to 32 in the 9x100 list
DeleteWhat about Oreco and Marco Antonio as left back, can't they be in the 9x100 list ?
ReplyDeleteWhat about Virgil Van Dijk? He had an amazing season as a defender, one of the best.
ReplyDeleteAt least can we evaluate his skills ?
DeleteFigueroa was 19, Pele around 28. The article says that Pelé ended up very sad and Figueroa performed a monumental performance !!! In the picture Figueroa is seen making the movement of the Chilean in the air (bicycle?).
ReplyDeletehttps://www.megafutbol.net/proxy.php?image=http%3A%2F%2F2.bp.blogspot.com%2F_VS1eJm_7vSo%2FSqq7hK0Bz1I%2FAAAAAAAABXg%2FS03bd4gP1t0%2Fs1600%2F11623.jpg&hash=9661862482bd8514910c808797b500e5
At 19, Figueroa was already the best player in the Uruguayan league, which at that time, that league was the best in the world with all the South American stars together. Figueroa was 3 times the best player in the Uruguayan league when he was only 22 years old.
Figueroa has an amazing trajectory, with incredible performances, as in the 1974 World Cup ... but you ask G. Muller where the ball was in the area XD
Someone here has a serious hard on for S.Ramos. Yes among today's defenders he is one of the best. But there are atleast 10 better Italians alone in an all time ranking. Modern defenders are nowhere near the quality of 20-30 years ago. R.Carlos? World class athlete, very good, but not great, footballer. Being fast, able to kick very hard and jump high are not footballing qualities. Maybe there should be sub sections. Beckenbauer was a fantastic player. But on defending alone he wouldn't even make the list. Best all round player to regularly play at the back certainly. So to say he's the best defender ever is kind of a misrepresentation. Turning it on its head how can Bobby Moore be ahead of people like Facchetti or Krol? Surely they are more "complete" If Beckenbauer is #1 for being an all rounder then isn't is contradictory to put an admittedly brilliant defender like Moore ahead of them? But brilliant site, and loving the info on old players. Keep up the good work
ReplyDeleteHierro should be higher, great player, also he didn't win the world cup in 82 with Spain, Italy won, and how Lucio isn't on this list i don't know
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